In the 1228, it would appear that which exact same Clemence along with her husband Nicholas had been selected for infant custody out-of Joanna and Llywelyn's daughter Susanna (aged regarding 14?). seems to be for the youngster to get brought up during the a safe and you will safer ecosystem with the chance of a far greater training. possible was being kept away from their unique. The new custodial offer is because of the King Henry III, half-sister to help you Joanna and you will half of-bro so you can Susanna, the decree entitled Susanna, Henry's ‘niece' and Joanna, Henry's ‘sister'.'
A question today presents by itself. If the Joanna are the fresh new daughter out of Clemence ce Boteler, regarding, apparently an English home, how can we explain just what Joanna try starting in France when Queen John sent getting their during the 1203? That you can easily answer is you to Clemence's dad, Philip le Boteler are French, in lieu of English. It absolutely was common at that time for all those to hold attributes into the both sides of your own Route. So it ed his dilies than in English parents during this time.
Really the only book in which We have came across a mention of Clemence Pinel – wife of Henry Pinel (aside from Charles Kolumbia naishenkilГ¶itГ¤ Cawley within the Wikipedia) is during Alison Weir's ‘England's Regal Group: The entire Genealogy and family history (London area, 1989).' Which guide is detailed because of the you to genealogist just like the ‘not as fully annotated.' My very own trawl through the genealogy message boards discover scant resource towards the Pinel family unit members, plus Clemence's partner Henry Pinel. Several entries advise that Joanna is actually the latest daughter regarding Henry Pinel with his spouse Clemence, but zero source, capable of being appeared, are offered. I'm hence lured to write off so it woman out of subsequent studies. I am able to be most incorrect.
Amount of Mortain, from inside the Normandy, knew off their [and perhaps
Clemence de- Fougers is the brother regarding Richard de- Hommet, Constable from Normandy, and you will Geoffrey de- Fougeres. Their own dad was William du Fougers. I have no date from birth (otherwise death) regarding Clemence, however, she was first partnered before 1200 (zero go out available) in order to Alan de Dinan, and you can are preferred adequate to marry in October 1200, since their unique second partner, Ranulph de- Blundeville, Earl away from Chester and Vicomte d'Avranches, recently separated (wedding annulled?) off Constance from Brittany.
In 1189, aged seventeen, Ranulph had been married to Constance of Brittany the widow of Henry 11 ‘s son Geoffrey, and the mother of Arthur of Brittany with whom King John contested the succession. Henry did not trust the Countess and wanted her married to a magnate he could trust. The marriage gave Ranulph control of the earldom of Richmond and the duchy of Brittany, but it was not a success (see subject 6. below). The couple had no issue and they separated. It was rumoured one Earl Ranulph separated Constance in order to have had an event which have King John!
Naturally, do it Clemence function as the mother from Joanna, she would additionally be the latest granny away from Susanna, even though there isn’t any reason to trust your younger Joanna know, now, there are children relationships, if the
Since Clemence de Fougers is actually child and you will brother of Constables of Normandy, It’s think possible that John, *knew* their, before her relationship to help you Ranulph]. A virtually connection to John you will describe what can see a highly useful next marriage getting Clemence to Ranulph.
Ranulph, 6 th Earl regarding Chester not, try a strong baron and it beggars trust, about for my situation, he could have approved a marriage so you're able to a woman just who got got a well-known fling and you will a following child because of the John, Number regarding Mortain specific a decade previously. Like considering the rumours encompassing a prospective fling between John and you may his first wife Constance!